Is our national debt finally too much? (update)

我们的国债终于太多了吗?(更新)

Planet Money

2026-09-23

29 分钟
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(Note: A version of this episode originally ran in 2024.) $40,000,000,000,000. Four commas. Thirteen zeroes. It’s an eye-popping, almost infinite-sounding pile of money. And every time the debt passes a big round number, almost everyone asks the same question: How much debt is too much? It’s maybe the most important question in macroeconomics. It’s also surprisingly hard to answer. When two economists tried to answer it back in 2010, it ignited a research slugfest that lasted a decade.  We did a show on this question in 2024, outlining everything we know and don’t know about when the national debt becomes a problem. But a lot has changed. Interest rates have risen and stayed high. Spending has steamrolled ahead. Doves have become hawks.  So on today’s show, we update our 2024 episode to revisit the age-old question: Is our debt finally too much?  Read Planet Money:  Our book: Planet Money: A Guide to the Economic Forces That Shape Your Life Our weekly longform Planet Money newsletterOur weekly Indicator round-up newsletterFollow:  InstagramTikTokYouTubeFacebookSupport public media with NPR+ and enjoy perks for over 25 podcasts like this one. This show’s perks include bonus episodes and sponsor-free listening. Learn more at plus.npr.org. Our original episode was produced by Willa Rubin and edited by Molly Messick. This update was reported and produced by Vito Emanuel. It was fact checked by Sierra Juarez. It was engineered by Kwesi Lee. And it was edited by Alex Goldmark, Planet Money’s executive producer.  See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences. NPR Privacy Policy
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  • This is Planet Money from NPR.

  • Okay, we are going to start today's show by jumping into the old Planet Money time machine.

  • Economic Destination 2009. A time when the government was spending

  • lots and lots of money and the national debt was shooting up.

  • Yeah.

  • Back then, the U.S.

  • Was trying to pull itself out of the recession that followed the financial crisis.

  • And one of the big strategies the government used was just to spend and spend and spend.

  • We bailed out some banks.

  • We lowered taxes.

  • There was all this money for infrastructure.

  • Early in the recession, I think a lot of people

  • were very supportive of the big steps the government took to increase government spending and reduce taxes.

  • That is Karen Dynan.

  • She teaches at Harvard now.

  • Earlier in her career, she worked at the Federal Reserve, did a stint as the chief economist at the Treasury Department.