Annie Jacobsen on Nuclear War, Intelligence Operations, and Conspiracy Realities

安妮·雅各布森谈核战争、情报行动与阴谋现实

Conversations with Tyler

2025-08-06

57 分钟
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单集简介 ...

Annie Jacobsen has a favorite word for America's nuclear doctrine: madness. It's madness that any single person has six minutes to decide the fate of civilization, madness that we've built weapons capable of ending the world in 72 minutes, and madness that everything hangs by the thread of deterrence. But to Tyler, life is "a lot of different kinds of madness," and the real question is simply getting the least harmful form available to us. It's a conversation sparked by her latest book Nuclear War: A Scenario, which Tyler calls one of his favorites from last year—and which is compelling enough that Denis Villeneuve is turning it into a screenplay. Tyler and Annie explore whether we should be more afraid of nuclear weapons or if fear itself raises the risks, who should advise presidents during the six-minute decision window, whether moving toward disarmament makes us safer or more vulnerable, what Thomas Schelling really meant about nuclear war and rational actors, the probability that America would retaliate after a nuclear attack, the chances of intercepting a single incoming ICBM, why missile defense systems can't replicate Israel's Iron Dome success, how Pakistan-India nuclear tensions could escalate, why she's surprised domestic drone attacks haven't happened yet, her reporting on JFK assassination mysteries and deathbed phone calls, her views on UFOs and the dark human experiments at Area 51, what motivates intelligence community operators, her encounters with Uri Geller and CIA psychic research, what she’s working on next, and more. Read a full transcript enhanced with helpful links, or watch the full video on the new dedicated Conversations with Tyler channel. Recorded May 19th, 2025. Help keep the show ad free by donating today! Other ways to connect Follow us on X and Instagram Follow Tyler on X Follow Annie on X Sign up for our newsletter Join our Discord Email us: cowenconvos@mercatus.gmu.edu Learn more about Conversations with Tyler and other Mercatus Center podcasts here.
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  • Conversations with Tyler is produced by the Mercatus Center at George Mason University, bridging the gap between academic ideas and real-world problems.

  • Learn more at mercatus.org.

  • For a full transcript of every conversation, enhanced with helpful links, visit conversationswithtyler.com.

  • Hello everyone and welcome back to Conversations with Tyler.

  • Today I'm chatting with Annie Jacobson.

  • Annie started off by studying at Princeton.

  • She now has, I think, eight books.

  • Most recently and prominently is a favorite of mine.

  • It's called Nuclear War, a scenario, was one of my favorite books of last year.

  • The book is also being turned into a screenplay and will be directed by the Dune Director, Dennis Villanueva.

  • Annie also has co-written three episodes of Tom Clancy's Jack Ryan TV series for Amazon Studios.

  • Annie, welcome.

  • Thank you so much for having me.

  • Now your last book, of course, it focuses on nuclear weapons and nuclear war.

  • Would it actually help if we were more afraid of nuclear weapons and thinking about them more often?

  • Or does that just not help at all?

  • I think it certainly helps, and you probably gathered that from reading my book.

  • I mean, what I wanted to do, sometimes people say, why did you write such a terrifying book?

  • And the answer is very simple.

  • I wanted to demonstrate in appalling detail just how horrific nuclear war would be as a way perhaps for people to have precisely the kind of conversation that you and I are having.