The Real Loser of the V.P. Debate

副总统的真正失败者 辩论

The Opinions

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2024-10-03

11 分钟
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M. Gessen, an Opinion columnist, watched Tuesday’s vice-presidential debate with a sense of dread. In their mind, the question was not who would win the debate but, rather: How much did we lose? In this audio essay, Gessen argues that when we put Trump and his acolytes on the same platform as regular politicians and treat them equally, “that normalization degrades our political life and degrades our understanding of politics.” Thoughts? Email us at theopinions@nytimes.com.
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  • This is the Opinions, a show that brings you a mix of voices from New York Times opinion.

  • You've heard the news.

  • Here's what to make of it.

  • My name is Masha Gessen.

  • I'm an opinion columnist at the New York Times and a distinguished professor at the Craig Newmeric School of Journalism at the City University of New York.

  • I write about politics.

  • I specialize in Russia and autocracy and LGBT rights.

  • I went into Tuesday's vice presidential debate with a sense of dread because I thought that the last debate was kind of a disaster.

  • And by disaster, I don't mean that Kamala Harris didn't hold her own against Donald Trump or that Donald Trump scored any points in the debate, but that the fact of the debate itself and the format of the debate, which placed these two candidates on a sort of level footing, treated them both as normal politicians and treated the things they said as normal political statements.

  • And so while there were some, I would say, half hearted attempts at fact checking Donald Trump, basically it turned into he said, he said, where on the one side you had a lie and on the other side you had facts.

  • So, for example, the way that the moderators of the presidential debate handled the Springfield, Ohio slander.

  • They're eating the dogs.

  • The people that came in, they're eating the cats, they're eating their.

  • And the moderator said, well, we called the city manager and the city manager said they aren't.

  • I'm not taking this from television.